Episode 18
Wedding Planning, Five Brothers and Friendship Breakups: A People Pleaser's Journey with Megan
In this episode of Diary of a Recovering People Pleaser, Jenny explores the journey of overcoming people pleasing with this week's guest, Megan. You’ll hear from Megan about how she navigated the challenges of planning her wedding amidst family expectations and social pressures. She talks about how people pleasing played a role in her wedding planning experience - and how she handled some difficult conversations!
They discuss the role that anxiety plays in people pleasing and how to manage it.
Jenny shares practical techniques like meditation to manage anxiety and set boundaries. If you're looking to start meditating - she walks you through two mantra meditations that you can start with.
Additionally, they discuss the emotional complexities of friendship breakups, balancing personal happiness with external pressures, and how our childhood experiences shaped our people pleasing habits (especially Megan, who grew up with 5 brothers!)
Plus, a mini book talk in the middle since we are both avid readers!
Books Mentioned:
- Power of Now by Eckhart Tolle
- ACOTAR series by Sarah J. Maas
- Throne of Glass series by Sarah J. Maas
- Four Thousand Weeks by Oliver Burkeman
- Run for your Midlife (Good to the Last Death series) by Robyn Peterman
About the Guest
Megan Heimbueger
I’m a pet sitter and artist!
About the Host
Interested in being a guest? Email Jenny: info@meditatewithjenny.com
- Work with Jenny - Book 1:1 Reiki or psychic channeled reading sessions. Offered virtually or in person in Buffalo, NY. Jenny also offers Reiki certification classes!
Copyright 2024 Jenny Leckey LLC
Transcript
I love that you love dogs and I love dogs
and we both pet sit and it's awesome.
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:I think that's so cool.
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:What a common ground and
who doesn't love dogs?
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:My two little sausage dogs are so cute.
5
:They're so cute.
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:They're my babies.
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:How old are they?
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:Six and four.
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:Oh my goodness.
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:I can't believe it.
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:It makes me sad.
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:Just in the blink of an eye too.
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:It does.
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:I got my golden as a
puppy and he's now eight.
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:I'm like, how did that happen?
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:I put a collage together
the other day of my dog.
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:She's becoming so gray.
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:And that moment I was sad and I
was like, what a privilege it is to
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:watch them grow old, it's so true.
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:Yeah.
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:I remember seeing something online too,
where they said, take your dogs out and
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:enjoy it because they only have a limited
amount of summers and they spend them
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:all with you And I was like don't make
me cry Why are you doing this to me?
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:My and like when you're walking a
dog when they're sniffing let them
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:sniff because it gives them so much
Serotonin and they only have so many
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:walks and oh, yes, that's so true.
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:Be present.
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:Yeah.
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:Important question, do
you dress your dogs up?
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:Because I do.
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:I sometimes do.
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:She has some Halloween costumes.
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:Nice.
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:They're very good.
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:What's your favorite outfit for your dogs?
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:If we're going with Halloween costumes,
I have the UPS delivery person costume.
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:That's so good.
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:Which is hilarious.
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:And the pirate costume,
which makes me laugh.
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:Oh, they don't like the hats,
but it makes me chuckle.
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:It's always a hat.
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:Anything else will tolerate.
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:My dogs have an Instagram.
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:Oh my gosh, why am I not following it?
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:I'm just relying on the personal page.
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:I know.
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:Oh.
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:Screw the humans, let's see
the four legged awesome babies.
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:The good stuff, get to the gold, yeah.
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:I have like fancy coats for my dog.
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:Yeah.
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:Like in the winter, especially because
the snow just gets in her fur and she's
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:soaked, so like, why not cover her up?
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:Oh yeah, that's so sweet.
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:Yeah.
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:Double purpose.
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:When we're not trying to please
our animals, we're also pleasing
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:people and that's what we're
here to talk about today.
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:I don't mind being a doggie pleaser.
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:Yeah.
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:Cause they're just there
for you, but goes both ways.
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:As far as humans go, yeah, that's
what we're going to dive into today.
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:How about you tell us a
little bit about yourself?
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:My name is Megan.
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:I obviously have two dogs.
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:I have a golden and a
chow lab mix named Keela.
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:And I live with my partner,
Michael of almost five years.
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:Awesome.
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:Yeah.
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:We have an orange and yellow
kitchen, which I think is something
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:that speaks very loudly about
me of who I am as a person.
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:Just cause it's so fun.
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:Yeah.
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:Life is too short not to have fun.
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:I have five brothers and a lot and I'm
tting married in September of:
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:Yeah.
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:Congratulations.
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:Which is mostly what I, like, when I
saw your Instagram post, it was what I
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:was like, Oh, I, this is what I have.
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:Cause it's just been on my mind,
this entire process of planning.
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:Wow.
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:I also work weddings too.
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:So I work for like a photo booth.
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:Oh, gotcha.
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:So you see all different kinds of things.
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:I'm sure.
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:Oh, absolutely.
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:And I think you see what you
do and don't want when you're
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:planning your own wedding, too.
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:Oh, yeah.
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:Yeah, so definitely gave me like
the inside scoop going from behind
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:the curtain, yeah, exactly.
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:Yeah.
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:Jumping from there, you already
hinted at what brought you here today.
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:You're talking about your connection
with people pleasing in your wedding.
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:How what's going on?
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:I Think that with any wedding
you find people just want to have
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:their own opinions about your day
Which is so interesting to me.
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:They just push their opinions on you . My
mom I'm the youngest of those five boys,
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:so I'm the only girl . For her, it was her
dream to just have me have the big wedding
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:and do all the things and that just,
I'm very introverted in a sense where I
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:don't like to be the center of attention.
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:My partner doesn't really either.
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:So we decided early on if we were going
to have a wedding, it'd be very small.
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:With my mom, so grateful, love her
to death, mom, if you're listening.
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:But I think she had to grieve that a
little bit, like that process of grieving.
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:Just realizing that the child that you've
raised, isn't the person that you expected
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:them to be and being okay with that.
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:I think that was definitely a process
for her, but in trying to people
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:please her, I was like, Why don't
I have the wedding that I want?
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:I'll also give her the wedding
that she wants cause she was very
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:upset about it and kept having
these conversations with me.
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:So to please her, I went down to Pearl
street, which I love Pearl street so much.
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:And we did the quote, we did the
walkthrough, the tour, everything
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:picked out, like the plan that I
would do for my wedding and It came
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:to be about 8, 000, which is crazy.
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:And that's like the low
end of weddings nowadays.
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:Which blows my mind.
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:It's crazy.
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:It's none of it makes sense.
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:After this whole walkthrough,
I really had to sit down with
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:myself and say, what do I want?
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:What does my partner want?
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:What do I want?
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:And why are we doing this?
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:Wow.
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:That's really good because I
don't think people, a lot of times
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:are mindful during that process.
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:Oh, absolutely.
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:I think, especially with people pleasing,
someone will ask you something to do
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:something and right away you just want
to tell them yes or give them an answer.
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:And I think stepping back really helps
to evaluate who are you doing this for?
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:It's like the first question
you should ask yourself.
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:Does it align with the
person that you want to be?
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:Yeah.
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:Power therapy.
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:And then side note with that too.
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:I think if you've been people
pleasing for so long, when you
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:ask yourself, what do I want?
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:I think that's a hard question because you
don't know what you want because you've
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:wanted what other people have wanted.
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:Absolutely the entire time.
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:So it sounds simple, but that
actually can be somewhat of an
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:uncomfortable, painful process at first.
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:Absolutely.
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:I think also with a lot of people
pleasing, I get so in my head about it.
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:With anxiety, I'm always thinking about
upsetting people, or having them be
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:upset with me, and what is their reaction
going to be if I set this boundary?
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:And I think it's really helpful to take
myself out of that because half of the
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:time, it's not what you're expecting.
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:I saw this meme and it was a
list of things I worried about
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:that, they ended up being fine.
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:So you worry about so much and you worry
about people's expectations of you.
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:Even if they're upset, if they
loved you and they want the best
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:for you, they would understand.
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:And I think that's something
definitely to remind yourself of.
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:to add on to that I always remind myself-
everyone is their own sovereign being.
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:They have their own
emotional guidance system.
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:They have their own ability to
emotionally regulate themselves.
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:So it's not my job to manage someone's
emotions, to regulate it for them.
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:And then that's self
centered in a way too.
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:Who am I to say how they should feel if
I want to get philosophical with it,
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:sometimes you have to get uncomfortable to
grow and change and learn about yourself.
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:So maybe I'm supposed to be the one
who says this to someone to trigger
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:a thought or an emotion to then bring
something to the surface for them to heal.
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:Yeah.
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:And have growth themselves.
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:Yeah, at least that's what I
tell myself when I start to
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:try to spiral anxiety- wise.
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:Oh, for sure.
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:We're all adults, and I think that, like
you said, we're all going through our own
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:journey and we all have our own guidance
and rules that we make for ourselves and
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:our own emotions, and you can't control
how somebody else reacts, but you can
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:control how you react to that situation.
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:Is there a moment in your life where you
realized you were people pleasing or is
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:it just something that happened gradually?
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:I think it was burnout.
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:I think I was working like four
jobs at one point and it was
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:just getting to be too much.
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:It got to a point where it was
like, is the money worth it?
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:Am I putting myself first?
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:And then, Oh, am I letting these
people down by saying that I can't do
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:this role at this position anymore?
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:And I think that I was like, Oh, I'm
people pleasing this entire time.
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:And I'm doing this to make other
people happy when I'm miserable
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:and I'm suffering from this.
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:there was definitely a moment
I was sitting on my couch.
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:I was sobbing.
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:And my partner he said to
me, why are you doing this?
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:What are you doing this for?
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:And I really didn't have a good
answer because it wasn't for me.
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:That was when I started
putting myself first.
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:And I knew with this whole
wedding situation, I was going
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:to have to put myself first too.
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:How did you feel about that when
it first started the process then?
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:Interesting.
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:Cause it felt like I
was going into a battle.
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:Yeah.
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:How so?
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:I had to prepare myself for, especially
my mom, just to really , guard my heart.
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:I would say just to not let anything get
to me and to realize where she was coming
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:from, to understand her thought process
in everything that she had dreamed of.
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:I also think with having a small wedding,
there's a lot of people pleasing.
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:We're doing a five hours
away in the Adirondacks
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:and we've gotten a lot of backlash about
that, like people who aren't invited.
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:People will ask me straight up,
can I be invited to your wedding?
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:Wow.
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:Really?
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:I know.
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:I know.
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:And that takes some nerve.
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:That is like the opposite of people.
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:A people pleaser would
be like, Oh, it's okay.
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:Saying no is the hardest
thing for a people pleaser.
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:Yeah.
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:I just don't want to make anybody upset.
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:How do you handle it when someone tries to
insert themselves into your wedding plans?
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:Even the invite list,
not even the planning.
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:I really just reassure Oh, we're
having a very small wedding.
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:We already have the guest list.
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:We would love to celebrate
with you another time.
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:Perfect.
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:Did you plan ahead of time of
what you were going to say to
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:people or did someone hit you?
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:That's definitely the anxiety part.
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:I had to think of everything that
someone would say to me and what I
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:would respond back, which is, It's so
tiring to be in your own head, it is.
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:So you mentioned about the guest list.
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:Yeah.
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:And people inviting themselves.
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:How about your wedding?
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:You said it's distance.
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:You're traveling there.
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:Is it a kids free wedding or?
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:Yeah, and I think that's been
one of the biggest struggles too.
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:That's a whole other I feel
like power lifting of people
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:pleasing recovery right there.
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:Yeah Dealing with what you're
dealing with this wedding Especially
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:if you're having to tell people
that their kids aren't invited.
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:You are in the people
pleaser recovery Olympics.
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:I'm in the trenches.
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:You are.
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:this is like a triathlon here.
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:How do you handle the kid thing?
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:I think it's the hardest part of
this whole situation other than
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:really advocating for a small wedding
which that plays into no kids.
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:When I, obviously, I think I mentioned
I work weddings for my brother's company
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:Seeing things that I didn't want and
children was a thing that I didn't want.
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:Just because in my perspective there's
nothing for kids to do at a wedding.
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:They get bored.
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:They get restless.
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:They get, just crazy.
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:Yeah.
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:And we're having a three
night, four day wedding.
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:And I think that's especially
another layer of how hard it's been.
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:It's definitely upsetting for some people
and that's obviously not our intention.
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:We just really want to handpick
the people that we want to choose
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:to be there on our special day.
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:Yeah.
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:But it was in our heads.
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:It was one or none.
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:You have to have all or none.
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:Is a better way to put it.
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:You're always going to
hurt somebody's feelings.
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:So how did you literally handle it?
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:What did you say to people?
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:And then what did you do within
yourself to manage the tension that
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:arose when you disappointed someone?
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:It's probably the same way that
I put it where people would
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:try to invite themselves to our
wedding of I love your kids.
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:I love them.
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:They're a part of our family
and I do want to celebrate them.
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:I just don't think that this is the
place to celebrate and celebrate
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:at a different time to give them
another option and to compromise.
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:Compromising is a huge thing with
people pleasing and being a good person.
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:And yeah, like you said, you
can still do good things and
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:compromise and meet in the middle.
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:To really help myself gear up for that.
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:Really reminding myself, I have
to pull myself out of my own head.
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:These people may be upset, they
have their own emotions, they have
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:a right to their own emotions.
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:How do I react to that?
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:It's reminding myself that
we'll only be married once.
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:This is the event that we want.
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:And Just thinking about
what the end result will be.
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:Will I be happy if I compromise on this?
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:That's huge.
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:Do you journal this or do you literally
think about it or talk it out loud?
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:Thinking about it helps.
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:I only really journal when it's like
big things in my life, but I think
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:I need to start a little bit more.
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:Getting that out is so important.
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:I was talking in therapy about, it was
my wrists, I was talking about my wrists
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:of how they bother me sometimes and my
therapist was like, just say it out loud.
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:Oh, I'm really focusing on my wrist today.
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:And I did that and I was like,
Oh, it's so nice to just not be
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:stuck in your own head anymore.
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:it's such a silly little thing that you
wouldn't think about, but it's so free.
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:Maybe this isn't a healthy thing, but
I always think about I go worst case.
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:I'm like what happens if I forget this
reminder and I don't do this if I'm
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:going to be okay Will life move on?
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:Yes.
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:Yes.
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:Will I live?
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:I will be fine Will it maybe suck to
have to deal with the consequences?
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:Maybe but Same with people pleasing.
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:If I say this to this person,
they get really pissed off.
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:Am I going to survive it?
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:I've survived every other
hard conversation I've had.
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:So exactly.
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:Yeah.
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:Do I want drama?
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:No.
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:Do I expect it?
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:I hope not, but exactly.
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:Hope that we can all be adults,
if that problem arises, how
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:are we going to deal with it?
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:And the sun will rise again tomorrow.
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:Yeah, that's always helpful.
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:If something goes wrong and somebody's
upset, it'll be okay in the end.
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:Sometimes with that, I'll
do like a giant zoom out.
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:I will zoom out all the
way into outer space.
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:Sometimes it helps to look at a
picture of earth being this tiny
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:dot in the middle of the universe.
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:And you're like, this
literally doesn't matter.
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:It doesn't matter.
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:We're all these tiny people on a big
rock in space, . None of this matters.
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:Yeah, in five years will matter
in five months and five weeks.
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:Yeah, exactly and not in a
pessimistic way No way exactly.
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:Why is this such a big deal?
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:Yeah life is so short for things to be
such a big deal .You have to keep moving.
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:It's always growth.
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:It's always progress and
we're always learning,
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:The other day I was at breakfast
with my parents and I was talking
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:about the podcast launch party.
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:And then I'm also, I don't
know why I did this to myself.
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:I'm launching a podcast.
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:And then two weeks later, I'm doing
my first weekend long Reiki retreat.
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:Like, why am I, what am I doing?
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:But I was talking through my
process in my mind about stages
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:of planning for all of this.
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:And then I was talking about,
okay, but if this goes wrong,
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:then I got this to back it up.
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:And then I thought about this scenario
and I have to tell myself that if no one
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:comes to the launch party, I'll be fine.
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:And if this many people come, I
have to manage my emotions.
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:And my dad just looked at
me and I was like, what?
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:What you don't think like this
dad and he's no, he looked
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:like a deer in headlights.
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:Yeah.
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:Almost like I was a little crazy and I
was like, welcome to inside my brain.
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:Welcome.
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:It's so interesting that people
who don't experience anxiety.
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:All right.
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:My partner, I'll be like, Oh, do you
know what we're doing for Thanksgiving?
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:And he was like, I'm not planning
for the end of the week yet.
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:What are you doing?
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:And I'm just so inside my head, I have
to know what's going on at all times.
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:Yeah.
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:And just spiraling that way.
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:But yeah, it's so interesting where
people just don't think of every
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:avenue and they're in the present.
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:I would love, I'm trying
to be more in the present.
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:That's something I'm working towards.
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:Meditation has really helped me.
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:I definitely, I love meditation.
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:Yeah.
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:Like consistently I know it sounds
weird, but I can tell that it's
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:rewired my brain because I don't have
patterns like I used to, or if they
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:rear their ugly head, I can sense it.
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:Whereas before it was just how I was.
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:Yeah.
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:So I don't know if that's better
or worse because now I can like
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:really tell what I'm anxious.
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:Whereas before it was just
a constant state of being.
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:It just happened.
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:Yeah.
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:So now I think it feels worse when I get
anxiety because then I'm like, damn,
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:I know it doesn't have to be this way.
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:Do you stop yourself and then meditate
as you're starting to feel that?
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:Sometimes or breath work or just
bringing myself into the present moment.
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:Using my five senses, just
make myself empty my brain and
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:just observe without labeling.
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:That's a big one from Eckhart Tolle
taught me that in the power of now.
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:I remember doing this for the
first time and I remember sobbing.
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:I don't know why.
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:I think it was just such an
relief emotional release.
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:Yeah.
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:To just observe.
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:I was outside on my porch and looking
at I'm labeling it for you, but , the
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:trees, the birds, what I was hearing
when I was seeing, smelling all
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:that tasting, but not giving it
any label just, ooh, that is there.
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:Not even, yeah, it's hard to explain.
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:No, I like that a lot though.
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:It empties your brain and it
brings you fully in your body.
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:Yeah, and not labeling.
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:Yeah, I really like that.
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:I'll have to try that out next time.
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:Because anxiety is the opposite.
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:It's let me label every single thing.
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:Every situation, every scenario.
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:Interesting.
403
:I'm sure it's not just Eckhart, I
think that's a pretty common thing,
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:but that's where I learned it from.
405
:I've never heard of that though.
406
:I'm surprised.
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:So technically that's a form of
meditation because you're emptying
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:your mind and being present.
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:Yeah.
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:Though type of meditation I'm
trained in, and that has really
411
:changed me was mantra meditation.
412
:Because your brain's going to brain,
you're going to think thoughts.
413
:Absolutely.
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:So giving yourself a Sanskrit mantra
to focus on, is taking control
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:of your brain back and saying, no
brain, we're focusing on this now.
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:Nope, nope, we're focusing on this now.
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:So at least it gives your
brain something to latch on to.
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:Yeah.
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:To pull yourself out of the
thought loops and into this moment.
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:An easy one to start with is hum.
421
:It means I am that I am.
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:It's connecting to your truest self.
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:Oh, I like that a lot.
424
:So forget I told you
that and just say so hum.
425
:But I love Kritajna Hum
("Krit-ah-nah Hum").
426
:Oh, to me, it's like a lullaby.
427
:It feels like an ocean
wave, the vibration of it.
428
:It means I am gratitude.
429
:Oh, that's lovely.
430
:When you're practicing mantra meditation,
you're using it because of the
431
:vibrational frequency of the mantra.
432
:So "Krit-ah-nah Hum", the vibration it
makes in your body is the equivalent
433
:of the energy of feeling gratitude.
434
:If that makes sense.
435
:It does make sense.
436
:Yeah.
437
:It's like how you feel in your
body with saying gratitude.
438
:When you chant "Krit-ah-nah
Hum", it's the equivalent.
439
:So it's activating that in you a
little metaphysical for you there.
440
:I love that though.
441
:Yeah.
442
:You can chant them out loud, but
most of the time you're saying it
443
:silently in your mind, almost like
you have a song stuck in your head.
444
:I really like that.
445
:I like the way that sounds too.
446
:Do you want to try saying it?
447
:You can say it.
448
:Kretina hum.
449
:Yeah.
450
:Kretina hum.
451
:Kretina hum.
452
:It feels so good.
453
:It feels good.
454
:It feels like a warm hug.
455
:Doesn't it?
456
:Yeah.
457
:It does.
458
:It's amazing.
459
:How chilled.
460
:Yeah.
461
:And if that's not a message of words
have power, I don't know what is.
462
:Oh, absolutely.
463
:Circling back to people, pleasing
what you're saying to yourself.
464
:Love.
465
:And saying to others that vibrational
frequency is impacting your life.
466
:Oh, absolutely.
467
:So not even about necessarily the
choices you're making as a people
468
:pleaser, but if you're abandoning
yourself and saying things that aren't
469
:in alignment with you and they're
vibrating with someone else, you're not
470
:even connecting with who you really are.
471
:No wonder why.
472
:We all feel like crap.
473
:I know.
474
:I think too when I'm thinking about
people pleasing and if I'm having this
475
:dilemma of do I want to say yes even
though it's not in my best interest.
476
:Before I started setting those boundaries,
it was, Oh, I'm failing these people.
477
:Oh, I'm going to be upsetting.
478
:Like I'm not living up to their
expectation and changing that too.
479
:I'm putting myself first.
480
:I'm doing what's best for me.
481
:The people who love me will see that.
482
:Just change how you speak to yourself
and it just really changes the
483
:way that you see the world and see
every situation that you're put in.
484
:So essentially what I'm hearing you say is
putting yourself back into the equation.
485
:Absolutely.
486
:Which isn't selfish.
487
:I guess people might think it
goes too far the other way.
488
:It doesn't mean.
489
:Fuck everybody.
490
:I'm doing me.
491
:It doesn't mean that either.
492
:I'll just be here for you in my own way
and the way that best suits all of us.
493
:Exactly.
494
:Because when you're your best self,
you're your best self for everybody.
495
:Exactly.
496
:Yeah.
497
:When you're depleted and upset but
you're putting on a brave face when
498
:you're people pleasing, obviously
because you're pleasing them, you don't
499
:want them to know that you're upset.
500
:You're really not your best self
and you're not doing your best work
501
:and you're not putting yourself
out there the way that you should.
502
:You'd mentioned about
putting yourself first.
503
:Yeah.
504
:What are some ways that you've done this?
505
:Do you have new habits or strategies or
hobbies that you do to make that shift?
506
:I think now I'm very busy, but I
still try to make an hour a day.
507
:I have to have at least
an hour a day for myself.
508
:Mostly it's right before bed.
509
:I make sure that I'm in bed at a certain
time to read my book before I go to sleep.
510
:I paint a lot.
511
:I love painting.
512
:Oh, nice.
513
:Yeah.
514
:What kind of painting?
515
:Ceramics.
516
:Ooh.
517
:My mom actually used to own a ceramic
business and she got out of it.
518
:And so when I got back into it,
she really fully supported me.
519
:Now I have a studio in my home.
520
:It's very cute.
521
:That's awesome.
522
:It's definitely a way where I can
ground myself and really put my best
523
:creative foot forward and really focus
on something instead of being in my head.
524
:And I think that's what the
reading too, you really just
525
:take yourself out of your body.
526
:Yeah, and focus on what's
in front of you true.
527
:I love reading I will say though
sometimes with me reading is a slippery
528
:slope of escapism though Yes, like
it can go too far the other way where
529
:it's almost a form of I guess you'd say
Disassociation where yeah life's too much.
530
:Let me go hide in a book I think that's
been a pattern my whole life for myself.
531
:I definitely understand that especially
If I'm having the Sunday scaries,
532
:I'm like, let's just read my book.
533
:Escape from this feeling or
the thought that I'm having.
534
:I think that's something I need
to work towards is sitting with
535
:that feeling and trying to work
through it instead of just escaping.
536
:It got to a point where I was bringing
my Kindle cause I've had that where I
537
:just use it for dissociation and I'll
bring my Kindle everywhere with me.
538
:And anytime I have a single
moment to just relax.
539
:I'm reading just to escape.
540
:We've told that reading
is so good for you.
541
:Reading is good.
542
:So you don't feel as bad.
543
:Exactly.
544
:As just like another coping mechanism.
545
:Being present I think is like the
theme, yeah being present with yourself
546
:especially in those moments, too.
547
:I have to ask what are your
favorite genres or what are you
548
:currently reading right now?
549
:Oh My favorite genres are fantasy romance.
550
:Yes, II.
551
:Did you read actor?
552
:I read ACOTAR before it was
popular, like a few years ago.
553
:As soon as I got back into reading, my
friend was like, you need to read this.
554
:Shout out to Marina.
555
:She changed my life.
556
:With ACOTAR, I was
like, where have I been?
557
:Throne of Glass is such an adventure.
558
:I loved that series.
559
:Although there's some parts where I'm
like, you gotta cut these chapters out.
560
:But overall, yeah it's great.
561
:It's such a slow build, but
the payoff is so worth it.
562
:It is.
563
:Yeah.
564
:What am I reading right now?
565
:Actually reading.
566
:It's like an ACOTAR knockoff.
567
:It's called rhapsodic.
568
:Oh, never heard of it.
569
:It's pretty good.
570
:I'm enjoying myself.
571
:If I look past all the similar traits
to the ACOTAR books, I can enjoy.
572
:Yeah.
573
:Nice.
574
:What about you?
575
:What are you reading?
576
:I'm the type who has multiple
books going at one time.
577
:I don't know if you're that way.
578
:So let's see, I'm
finishing Throne of Glass.
579
:And then, I'm reading this
book called 4, 000 weeks.
580
:It's a time management book.
581
:Do you think the time management
has helped especially with all
582
:the things coming up for you?
583
:Yes, it has because It's a
unique take on time management.
584
:He talks a lot about How much grief
comes with managing your time, because
585
:at any time you are picking, like for
instance, you chose to allocate time
586
:to be here today, which I appreciate
so much, but that means that you
587
:said no to a million other options.
588
:And a lot of time there's grief with that.
589
:If I say no to going out to this
concert with my friends because
590
:I need time alone at home today.
591
:I'm going to have grief about
I'm missing out on that.
592
:Was this the right choice?
593
:He really talks about processing
that and that's helped me a lot.
594
:I like that a lot too.
595
:I feel like we all experienced
that, especially when your friends
596
:go out to that concert and you
see them having a great time.
597
:You're like, Oh, why didn't I
want to go have a great time?
598
:But you're really just
putting yourself first.
599
:The book is called 4, 000 weeks time
management for mortals by Oliver Berkman.
600
:I'll put this in the show notes.
601
:It gets philosophical.
602
:But it really ties into people pleasing
too, because a lot of the times we
603
:manage our time around what other
people want and not what we want.
604
:So then it talks about not only
the grief, but also being mindful
605
:about how you're spending your time.
606
:Like being honest with yourself too.
607
:Being honest is the biggest part.
608
:Yeah.
609
:Yeah.
610
:Do you think there was a part,
cause I can't remember when I
611
:started people pleasing, I feel
like it's just been ingrained in
612
:me for the longest period of time.
613
:Yeah.
614
:How about you?
615
:Yeah, I think it's just, Upbringing
wise now having an outside bird's eye
616
:view of my family's cultural norms,
is apparent that is what is expected.
617
:Okay.
618
:Keep the peace.
619
:Yeah.
620
:We don't rock the boat.
621
:Put a smile on your face.
622
:Yeah.
623
:And then also to play on
that, the good girl mentality.
624
:I was such a good girl won
all the awards, little leader.
625
:Pleasure to have in class.
626
:Oh, such a pleasure.
627
:Always a pleasure.
628
:Yeah.
629
:Always a pleasure.
630
:And now I'm looking back
and I'm like, was I really?
631
:Is that, who would I have been if I?
632
:Exactly.
633
:I don't know.
634
:How about you?
635
:Do you feel like you were
always a people pleaser?
636
:Oh, absolutely.
637
:I think in the last two to three
years, I've really come out of it.
638
:Which it doesn't seem
like that long of a time.
639
:I think that shift, I've seen so
much growth in myself and really
640
:acceptance for what I want.
641
:And like you were saying, like
a bird's eye view of my life.
642
:I think that's so important to to
look at yourself from a different
643
:perspective, if that makes sense.
644
:Yeah.
645
:I find that with that too There's a
little exercise of if this conflict or
646
:this situation was happening to somebody
that you love And like your best friend,
647
:how would you want them to handle it?
648
:And obviously you want them to
put themselves first That's good.
649
:Yeah, so taking that perspective Of being
like, Oh, if it's not happening to me,
650
:it's happening to somebody that I love.
651
:I think now working towards body
acceptance and loving myself.
652
:Now I'm trying to be like,
Oh, I am that person.
653
:I am that best friend
and my own best friend.
654
:Yeah.
655
:Oh that's huge.
656
:I feel like that's similar to
what I'm going through myself.
657
:I'm not fully healed, obviously.
658
:Oh, absolutely.
659
:It's always a work of progress.
660
:41 years of building this ship.
661
:It's going to take a while to be
constructed, but that's amazing.
662
:How about your childhood?
663
:Because I was mentioning about being the
good girl the good student and all that.
664
:How about you?
665
:Yeah, I think the same.
666
:I think I always just wanted to keep my
head low And just get by and just have
667
:everyone just be okay I didn't want to
rock the boat as you were saying with your
668
:family And I think that played out into
adulthood with not even dealing with it
669
:and not even realizing I was doing it.
670
:It's just ingrained in me.
671
:And to really undo that
working inside of you.
672
:This just popped into my head.
673
:Yeah.
674
:You said you have five brothers.
675
:Yeah.
676
:Do you notice a difference
between your brothers and you
677
:as it comes to people pleasing?
678
:You have a first hand view of not
only sibling differences, but also
679
:male, female, gender, whatever you
subscribe to, whatever you were, Yeah.
680
:Raised as what differences do you see?
681
:I find that my brothers, so
none of them experience anxiety.
682
:Really.
683
:Wow.
684
:Which is so fascinating.
685
:My brother and I have conversations
all the time of now he
686
:understands anxiety because of me.
687
:But to hear how his brain works and
how he doesn't really get into his
688
:head like that is so fascinating.
689
:But I think with.
690
:Men, like not generalizing, but in my
experience, I think they grow up in a
691
:way where they do put themselves first.
692
:And for women you are always meant to
please, you're always meant to be like
693
:a servant in a way to other people.
694
:And men don't have that.
695
:So that's really interesting.
696
:Did you experience any
of that in childhood?
697
:I honestly can't remember.
698
:I can't remember.
699
:That's good.
700
:That means you don't
have That's really good.
701
:Yeah.
702
:Nothing definitive happened.
703
:Cause we range like 13 years to
see the differences between them.
704
:It feels like we're in totally
different households and we've
705
:grown up to be different people.
706
:It's so interesting, especially
with people pleasing.
707
:I'm always trying to
be there for everybody.
708
:And they also are that way too.
709
:They're always there for
me and stuff like that.
710
:But the attitude behind it,
it's oh, they want to do this.
711
:And I think obviously
we're both good people.
712
:You want to do good things
for the people that you love.
713
:but there comes to a
point where it's too much.
714
:And I feel like knowing that
threshold of when it's too much.
715
:Great point.
716
:So this sparks a debate sometimes with
people, because a lot of this conversation
717
:is basically holding a mirror up to people
and that's painful sometimes when you
718
:are faced with your own patterns, right?
719
:So it's so interesting doing this podcast,
even just talking about it with people,
720
:how others will come to me and open up.
721
:But then also when you start doing
this work it leads to some confusion.
722
:You're like.
723
:But I want to help people that doesn't
necessarily make me a people pleaser.
724
:And then they're saying what if I do
something that I don't want to do, but
725
:it's for my spouse, or it's for my family.
726
:Does that make me a people pleaser?
727
:There's a difference
between that and compromise.
728
:Yes.
729
:, it's a very nuanced thing.
730
:Nothing is clean cut.
731
:Exactly.
732
:The human experience is so complex.
733
:We want to be kind to people, but
it's maybe the difference is you run
734
:it through your own filter, you're
not just reflexively doing stuff.
735
:You're actually pausing and
making the decision for yourself.
736
:Absolutely.
737
:Does this align with the
person that I want to be?
738
:I think that helped me a lot, especially
when there was something I didn't want to
739
:do to really evaluate with that alignment,
cause do you want to be a good person?
740
:I think that everybody does in
some sort of way, unless you're
741
:like a Disney evil villain.
742
:I have a question with people
pleasing and the shift you've seen
743
:in yourself over the past few years.
744
:Yeah.
745
:How have the people around you reacted?
746
:Ooh, that's a good question.
747
:I think it's difficult for some especially
people who are very close to you who
748
:haven't seen you put boundaries and don't
understand what boundaries really mean.
749
:Especially when people don't respect
those boundaries and they keep pushing
750
:and having to remind them over and over.
751
:And then all of a sudden
being like, I have reminded
752
:you I'm putting my foot down.
753
:It's interesting to see this shift
in yourself and see it in other
754
:people of how they react to you.
755
:Have you had any friendships or
relationships shift or go away?
756
:I don't think so.
757
:I think they've definitely changed, but
I think it's changed for the better.
758
:Oh good.
759
:That's awesome.
760
:Yeah.
761
:I think everyone, especially now
in my life, is very respectful.
762
:had friendships where it comes to
a point of wanting to be there for
763
:someone who isn't there for themselves
and trying to be that person for them.
764
:And then putting yourself first and
be like, I can't do this anymore.
765
:I need to protect myself.
766
:Yeah.
767
:I think that's like a
form of people pleasing.
768
:But like evaluating
them and stopping that.
769
:How about you?
770
:Over the years of all of this healing,
I definitely have lost friendships.
771
:Is it really a loss though?
772
:Exactly.
773
:Like I said, if it's the people who want
the best for you and love you the most.
774
:Exactly.
775
:They want to be there.
776
:A form of people pleasing
keeping this friend around
777
:cause I've been friends
with them for so long.
778
:I think that is a problem
that a lot of people have.
779
:Why are you still
friends with this person?
780
:Why do you still talk to them?
781
:Oh we've been friends since middle school,
or Oh, I've known him for this long.
782
:We've worked together for 20 years.
783
:or That can also be a form of people
pleasing, because you don't want to
784
:break up with your friend because
you've changed and they haven't, but
785
:you're not willing to let that go.
786
:Absolutely.
787
:Especially as you're growing if you don't
see growth in them, or they're not willing
788
:to have growth, It's very interesting
to be this is taking away from my joy.
789
:I need to walk away from this
relationship Yes, and that's so hard.
790
:It's so hard because we don't talk
about friendship breakups enough.
791
:It's devastating.
792
:It is.
793
:I had a friendship breakup of
11 years and it was on and off.
794
:I was trying to be there They
were in a toxic relationship.
795
:I couldn't be around . It got to a point
where they said they were going to leave.
796
:They kept going back and I was like, I
can't put my heart through this again.
797
:Yeah.
798
:Yeah.
799
:It's really hard.
800
:It's so hard.
801
:People don't talk about it enough.
802
:They don't.
803
:Yeah.
804
:It's very devastating.
805
:Cause especially when you spend so
much of your life with somebody.
806
:Even work friendships too.
807
:Yeah.
808
:Cause a lot of friendships, you're
so close cause you work together.
809
:And they don't last outside
of work when you move on.
810
:That's sad too.
811
:And you always say they're going
to, and then they just don't.
812
:You just fizzle out.
813
:Yeah.
814
:But having the courage to end
those relationships that aren't
815
:serving your highest good.
816
:Absolutely.
817
:For friendships and such is huge.
818
:One part of the healing journey I've
noticed with people pleasing and loving
819
:myself is who I surround myself with,
but intentionally looking for who
820
:speak my language and support me and
having those deep soul friendships.
821
:I intentionally, it was like I want to
surround myself with people who I can
822
:talk to you about this stuff or, my
spiritual side and that sort of thing.
823
:I don't want to hide who I
am, which I felt like I had
824
:to do so much as a teacher.
825
:I've made these soul
connection friendships here.
826
:Oh, I love that.
827
:The past few years.
828
:And it's been a beautiful thing to see and
witness and I think it's because I didn't
829
:people please myself with, just being
unintentional about who has surrounding.
830
:I guess I'll hang out with them.
831
:Yeah.
832
:But only because of this reason
of that I'm new and I'm back.
833
:Interesting.
834
:the light just flashed on and off.
835
:I'm pretty sure off and
on, so I'm pretty sure.
836
:The ghosts that haunt
this house agree with us.
837
:Yeah.
838
:Like good for you.
839
:They're like chair from the back.
840
:Have you had a similar experience at all?
841
:I think so.
842
:Yeah.
843
:I think now with all the friendships that
I've made, there's a common respect and
844
:there's a common admiration for really,
Being yourself and being your best self.
845
:Everybody who I'm surrounded with
really, I think, believes that we're
846
:all going through our own thing, but
being there for people where you can
847
:have deep connections, you can talk
deeply with them and feel like it's a
848
:safe space is really it's so valuable.
849
:Honestly you can't put a value on it.
850
:So taking a look at who you surround
yourself with will show you your patterns
851
:of people pleasing for sure Oh, absolutely
show you where you're abandoning yourself
852
:in some areas But really all of this comes
down to, in my opinion, having courage
853
:to put your wellbeing first, doing some
hard stuff to hit reboot on your life.
854
:Absolutely.
855
:It's the thought of what's the
worst thing that's going to
856
:happen if I put myself first.
857
:And nothing, because you're putting
yourself first, everything that follows
858
:was meant to be, especially people who
don't want to be in your life after that.
859
:They don't want What's best for you.
860
:Megan: I think there's this negative
connotation on the word selfish.
861
:Oh, it seems selfish to put myself
first , but you only have one life,
862
:what are you going to do with it?
863
:Are you going to spend your
whole life serving others?
864
:Are you going to serve yourself?
865
:True.
866
:Yeah.
867
:Jenny: Then you can help others more so
from a more stable centered place if you
868
:are taking care of your needs for sure.
869
:Absolutely.
870
:I've been wrapping up all the interviews,
asking people have, you could put a
871
:piece of advice on a bumper sticker.
872
:What would you put?
873
:Probably if will this matter in five
weeks, five months or five years?
874
:Ah, yes.
875
:Will it.
876
:Probably not.
877
:And you just worry about so much
and just to really evaluate,
878
:to be like, when will this.
879
:It valid.
880
:That's impacting your life right now.
881
:But realizing how small
of an issue this is.
882
:And it might be a big issue, but at five
years will be a big issue who knows.
883
:Probably not.
884
:You're like, oh, I don't want
to have to deal with this.
885
:Yeah.
886
:Is this conversation going
to matter in five years?
887
:Well, some of it might because you might
not be friends with the person anymore.
888
:No, but others know, like I can get
through feeling like crap right now.
889
:It'll be all right.
890
:And I think also with
anxiety and people pleasing.
891
:I'm always thinking about like my
reactions and how I'm handling things.
892
:A lot of people will not
remember that in five years.
893
:You're like, but I'm very head.
894
:Oh, good point.
895
:to you.
896
:Is it that big deal in the
universe of things like in your
897
:community and stuff like that?
898
:Really great point because we really
are all, I mean, it's just the
899
:human way, but we are all excited.
900
:Going to be the best time.
901
:That's awesome.
902
:Quality time with the people that I love.
903
:Yes.
904
:Oh, beautiful.
905
:I appreciate you making time to come
talk to us and thanks for having me.
906
:Yeah.
907
:Yeah, of course.
908
:Yeah.
909
:I saw your Instagram post.
910
:I got to do it.
911
:I love it.
912
:Amazing.
913
:I love how many people are being willing
to share their stories, to help others.
914
:And.
915
:Too.
916
:I think also, you know, show themselves.
917
:Their own growth.
918
:Absolutely.
919
:It was good to talk about your journey.
920
:Absolutely amazing.
921
:I hope that someone out there
that's like wedding planning
922
:understands and like sees us.
923
:So maybe it'll help a little Yes, I hope
so what they want their day to look like.
924
:Exactly.
925
:Yeah.
926
:Beautiful.
927
:Yeah.
928
:Well, thanks so much, Megan.
929
:Thank you.